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  • maria1
    sex and love are not the same thing. intimacy is not sex. passion is not sex.

    do you think he has a lover.

    divorce is a sure step that brings one very close to poverty.

    maybe you need a vacation away from him.
    you can go for a weekend at respite care.
    or spend two days at a motel.
    think it through.
    it is a very big move.
    one you can not undo. only liz could, and we don't look like her.

    think about what will make you happy, if you can't figure that out
    think about what makes you unhappy
  • pop
    Maria!  Once again, just like always, you are "spot on"  And if you do not mind me saying, from a man's perspective and psyche, it is not uncommon for men to say to each other when they meet, "Hi, how is your love life"? and that is then quickly followed by the question, "....and how is your sex life"?  I guess it is all how one looks at life and what they want to get out of it.  I am not even putting into the equation the changing morality, religion, self gratification, ego, trust, loyalty, compassion, communication and all of those other many archaic emotions that have given us the label of dinosaur.  I guess it all begins with the meaning of the word friendship which has also gone by  the wayside. 

    Let's face it - in this new world, you are either "cool" or "hip", or from another planet.
  • maria1
    Hey pop,
    Isee loyalty staring me in the face. It is a word seldom revered or. revered beyond reality. Do men use that term in relation to their relationship with women?

    I remember the old, kiss and tell, rule. When I was a teenager, back in the dark ages, do not kiss and tell was the most important rule. Perhaps because it was among the forbidden experiences. You could not kiss someone, or if you did it was an absolute committment. Now the reverse is the rule , kiss and tell. broadcast the success instead if savoring the success.

    Loyalty, do we each breach the rule without thinking or is it intentional.
    Loyalty, everyday life is empty of the pact between persons, not just lovers. There is a hunger that is not being fed, gimme gimme gimme to the bottomless pit.

    Perhaps time is the culprit, it is moving at the same pace but we are slower, or we are doing more and we do not see what is in front of us.

    Time, our share of the illusion of reality, the picture we paint with our eyes, that are fraught with our fears, angers, resentments, regrets, emptiness.

    Time lets us forget to care for ourselves first, thus we become needy, and the danger begins.
    Charles Dickens ghost, Beware this child, this child is ignorance, Beware this child, this child is want.

    And time moves or we move so quickly, we forget to pay attention. Or we simply forget.
  • pop
    Maria!  You truly have a gift, and I mean gift, for intuition and expression  Depending upon how you look at this gift, it can be a double edged sword.  Your reward will be the loyalty of friends or the wrath of those who will feel threatened.  In either case, this gift that you have will be the cross of lonliness that you will have to bear for the rest of time.  Believe me, I know, for I have born the same gift that is reflected in the sadness of  my eyes.  Believing in your convictions leads to a path of lonliness and isolation - an isolation from the mind set of the masses.  With time, you learn to cherish your gift.

    The price you pay is high.  But the reward is your dignity and your pride.....and that is something that is never for sale......never!

    Like you, I have found peace in  my life.  The scars are still there, and occassionally a tear will be shed, but until that time......I will try to smile.

  • maria1
    Hey pop.
    I wish it was intuition, it is more that I have been or am there. I am only speaking from experience. I lived life in the fast lane, I knew something was wrong and ran to make the green light. My maiden name started with an A, which means I was always first in line, first to go through something, first to be tested, first to be embarassed, first to fail. So I was accustomed to trying things 'no one had done before', and some memories do not fade. Especially the painful ones. So I am sharing what I have been through, not intuit. It would be nice if it was.
  • pop
    For me, one of the purposes of life is to have memories.  Then it is up to us to either learn from them or cherish them....even if they do bring back tears.

  • maria1
    The richness and honesty of your words touches the place of heart. It is almost a tear response, almost a smile. Emotions that have not yet reached the surface. True, a solace in the truth that stops the hurt from aching but acknowledges its presence. Your words shall linger with the day and at some point coalesce, becoming to the top, like the cream. There is something wanting to see the light of day, when it arrives I will share it. Like going through the ringer. I think it may hurt a little.
  • maria1
    Being recognized for your worth is only done when the one who is recognizing is in fact in need. We do not change,  as pop says, we are the same, it is just that their needs change, and they move us to the spot light because we have given them at the time, exactly what they need. Like the fountain that is always there, and people only drink when they are in need.
  • maria1
    Iheard someone say that you should not carry your past into the present unless it makes your life better.
  • angelsoul2

    I believe that all of those moments before today are  all part of  what makes you .... you. Good, bad or indiffrent is what will prepare you for making life better....

  • pop
    Didn't I just say that? so many words?  Think about it....and then you decide.

  • maria1
  • clarinetmom
    Yes! I'm struggling with the desirability issue, and not handling the idea of being 51, single again, and dealing with multiple medical issues. Who's really going to want to take on that load? At least my soon to be ex husband stayed, even if he didn't want me physically.
  • maria1
    Well girlie, I am 65 and no longer look in the mirror more than the once in a day when I wake wash my face and brush my teeth. I am no longer attractive, my hair is thinning enough to make me want to try rogane.Desirability? Duh! Clean!!!! That is my definition of desirability - If you ever rode the subway in any season, you would appreciate the sentiment, I lived in new york city and once had an assignement in newark new jersey so every morning I would get on the train to jersey and at that time it was said that the only people who went to jersey were the bums who went there to sleep. It was true.  I hated it, the stink! Or the steamy rainy day when the wool smells of everything and you are so short and get shoved in to some guys back and get to smell the swetty wool. or you sit next to someone who is eating peanuts - the smell of warm peanuts always made me think of elephants except for the pig sitting next to me. You are not the disease, the you will always shine through-except if it is you eating the peanuts on the subway.
     You could maybe sell this idea to  network!
  • maria1
    Gee, there is something to picture, Mrs Michelin with a bow! giggle
  • Rich1007
    Losing 110 lbs is an amazing accomplishment.  Congratulations!  I'm so sorry for you that your husband did not share in the joy, especially how you hoped he would.  

    We all are special and wonderful people.  Even if other people dont appreciate us.  Its not any different than our pre-MS days, just hurts more.  I am confused by why people often try to minimize intimacy by saying friendship and loyality are far more "important" than sex.  Dont get me wrong,  I agree that friendship and loyalty are extremely important and absolutely vital, but to keep things from getting flat and boring we need to have fun now and then too and why shouldn't the definition of fun include sex too (provided both parties are able to of course) along with all the other fun stuff, like boating, dinner, movies, watching movies, playing, parties, etc...
  • kyheartstrings
    That's how I feel, too.  But once the sex stopped, so did all the OTHER fun stuff. The COPD stopped that, but he can't hold me (he smothers), kiss me, or even hold my hand.  I no longer even feel like a woman.  Part of it is ME...weight gain, grey thinning hair, limping around....but when he gets the energy to make a 2hr drive to go to his daughter's (where there are lots of friends, friends of friends) but doesn't have the energy to go to a restaurant and TALK with me, it makes me feel he doesn't WANT to make any effort to do ANYTHING with me.
    Maybe he's afraid of hurting/breaking you!